Social aspect of being a wizard

[Chris]

First, play this to get into proper mood
http://worldoflords.com/misc/games/wiztowersim.php


Multiplayer game, you are a wizard. I look for *any* social related mechanics/rules/features that could be used here.


* Guilds - the most obvious, a clan/gang made of wizards. For social purposes.

* Master/Apprentice - Each player can have 1 master, and can have up to 5 apprentices (real players). If you are a master you get more action points for having apprentices. If you are apprentice you get free knowledge points ONLY IF your master if higher level than you are.

* Towers - Players can build towers (for free). Each tower can hold 8 players in luxurious appartments (most bonus points), 8 players in regular appartments (slightly less bonus points) and 8-16 players in cheap appartments (very few bonus points).

In addition there is a library in a tower. Each player can have any number of books (numbered 1-200). All books possessed by tower residents are shared in a library. If you own a book you get +2 to spells, if you do not have a book but it is in the library you get +1 to spells (so if you have no books on your own but join a tower with full set of books you get instant +200 to spells).

Each player has certain poll of upgrade points which he/she can use to improve the tower (for free).

Each player has "tower upkeep value", if such player is a resident of a tower it adds to it. If tower is left by too many wizards (like when the tower owner gets berserk or too despotic) it will collapse/downgrade.

[jannesiera]

Do you know about the anime "Fairy Tail" ? It's about wizards in guilds and the guilds are a very important aspect in the story. It's a very social building with a tavern and bulletin board for quests + an upper floor which holds quest for the super-powerful mages. Additionally guilds can have a basement, library, ... anything really . If wizards are not going on a quest they are hanging out in the guild. Also they usually form teams of 2-4 people to go on quests. Every guild has one leader. The leaders of the ten most powerful guilds form some sort of "council" who make sure the power balance in the world is kept.

Note that those mages are not traditional wizards like in Gandalf or Merlin but they have all sort of different "spells" and fight physical battles etc. http://www.bethumbed.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/Fairy_Tail_ch2_pages_14___15_by_Stefne.png

[Chris]

I was thinking about tower being a limited number of players and guild unlimited. Tower would affect gameplay, guild would be for social purposes. If an unlimited size guilds were to have any gameplay advantages then only few huge guilds would exist... Of course the guild could be limited size, but then it damages the social aspect since you have to kick out friends that are too weak...

Also they usually form teams of 2-4 people to go on quests.

Idea how to expand this?

Each wizard provides a certain service (enchanting, extracting essence from rare plants, improving magic crystals). Each wizard can provide their service to 6 players. The service quality depends on wizard's level. It costs nothing to privide the service.

[Chris]

Artifacts & services - each player create artifacts. When production of an artifact starts it become visible to everyone. An example artifact could require 100 hours of enchanting, 10 hours of magical calibration, 20 hours of crystal polishing. Anyone can donate some services (each player have 100 hours of services daily, but of their specialisation only, which is much more than enough to cover their own needs and there is plenty to lend to others). After adding service it is attached to the artifact (number of hours and level of service). The artifact owner can finish the artifact anytime (but no less than 48 hours realtime), when it is done the top best services accumulated are added and it determine the artifact quality. Then the player can sell the artifact or use it.

Common servces (for tower) - each player have a pool of common services hours, these are usable only for tower's objects. The tower is balanced the way it is the best functioning when 8 players dedicate their common services to the tower (so it is good to group since some things can be done only together while it is not needed to group as a horde since relatively few players can make their shared objects work at the best efficiency).


Still looking for a more direct cooperation (quests?). Also for some competition.

[Goffdahl]

How about adding familiars. Each mage could specialise in training familiars of a specific species and mages could trade familiars among them...

[dsheroh]

If you don't mind doing a bit of reading as research, you should check out the tabletop RPG Ars Magica.  The publisher gave away the pdf version of the 4th edition rules for free prior to the release of 5th edition, but that was a few years back and I'm not sure whether the offer still stands today or not.

In ArM, arcane society is made up of "covenants", groups of magi and hangers-on who live together in various places; in ArM terms, your towers would be covenants, more or less.  (A good covenant wouldn't just have 8 magi in it, but also a dozen or so "companions" (skilled or otherwise exceptional non-wizards) and maybe 30-50 "grogs" (basic fighter-types, bodyguards, etc.).)  There's excellent coverage of covenant libraries, which contain both grimoires of spells and summae/tractati of arcane lore to improve magical skills, and lab work, which includes enchanting items, arcane research, collecting vis (magical energy in physical form), familiars, apprentices, and so on.

On the social side, all magi are members of the Order of Hermes, which is composed of 13 Houses.  Most covenants have magi from multiple houses, allowing inter-House rivalries to play out on the small scale, while there are also periodic Tribunals where all the magi in a region get together to play politics and vote on whatever matters may be raised.  Although the magi are, at least nominally, primarily concerned with their own personal power, ArM has a strong tendency to become one of the most politically-focused TTRPGs out there.

Not to mention that it has tons of great spells like "The Earth's Carbuncle", "Ball of Abysmal Flame", "Disguise of the Putrid Aroma", "Frosty Breath of the Spoken Lie"...  (Yes, I am rather fond of the game.   )

[Topazan]

Maybe certain powerful spells/rites need to be cast as a group.  They cost each of the individual casters in mana and spell components, but achieve a far greater effect than they could achieve alone.  Possibly, they're designed to only benefit one person at a time, so players will have to trade favors with each other to get what they want.

To expand upon this, wizards could have different specialties.  Each great rite could require a different mix of specialties  Basically an adaption of the class/group paradigm.

[incarnate]

So what time period does this take place when wizards and apartments exist together? =] I'm picturing guys in wizard costumes in apartments, getting high.

Sounds like a good idea if you can flesh it out more. There aren't enough good group-based PBBG games that are done well (Estiah is the only one I know), but it's kind of understandable given the nature of the platform...

[Chris]

So what time period does this take place when wizards and apartments exist together? =]

The word "apartments" gives a feeling of a tight packed tower where wizards complain about their neighbours being too noisy which does not let them study tomes properly I think in that world (where there are several wizards per tower) magic would be quite common and most magic creatures nearly extinct due to massive hunting for components. But that's just a thought, at this stage it is not any specific game, just a collection of ideas about social life of wizards.

but also a dozen or so "companions" (skilled or otherwise exceptional non-wizards) and maybe 30-50 "grogs" (basic fighter-types, bodyguards, etc.).)

Hmmm, maybe it would work better if it wasn't a wizard game but multiclass game? Players could be wizards or warriors who need enchantments. Of course this would mean that the wizarding part would have to be simplified greatly.

Anyway, let's add to the topic "and social interaction of wizards with other player driven professions".

[Chris]

Writing books - each wizard can write a book. The content is selected by the player & affected by experience/discoveries. Then these books can be obtained by other players (usually lower level) to learn from. It would be nice for fame purposes since they will be using "The Art of Casting Thunderbolts by PLAYERNAMEHERE". Imagine players talking on the forum asking which book to read and they advice to go for a book of player X

How could it work? Why would players choose one book over another? What would be the limits of book reading (like study points), since otherwise they would just go and read all of them? Should these be sold or given/freely copied/obtained from public library?

[dsheroh]

It would be nice for fame purposes since they will be using "The Art of Casting Thunderbolts by PLAYERNAMEHERE". Imagine players talking on the forum asking which book to read and they advice to go for a book of player X

How could it work? Why would players choose one book over another?

Presumably because some are better than others and/or specialized in areas of interest to different players.  If PLAYERNAMENERE is a master of storm magic, his book should improve your Weather Magic skill more than a book written by someone specializing in Underwater Basket Weaving spells.

What would be the limits of book reading (like study points), since otherwise they would just go and read all of them?

I'd use time and disallow concurrent activities.  i.e., Studying a book takes X hours to complete and, during that time, you can't be casting spells/enchanting items/etc.  Given our respective tastes, I suppose you'd probably prefer to go with study points, like you said.

Scarcity is also an option - when the book is first written, there's only one copy, so only one person (chosen by the text's owner) can study it at a time.  New copies can be made in less time than writing or studying the text, but there's still an opportunity cost there in that time spent on copying texts takes away from other activities while providing no immediate return.

Edit:  This scarcity concept is one case that is handled more-or-less automatically by real-time-to-complete models ("I start studying the book at 12:57 and finish at 16:57; during those four hours, nobody else can use it"), but doesn't fit so naturally into an "action points" model - if you spend 5 seconds clicking "study book" until you run out of study points, then preventing anyone else from using the book during those 5 seconds isn't a very meaningful limitation.  How would you go about implementing a meaningful "only one person can study this book at a time" mechanic in an "action points"-based game?

Should these be sold or given/freely copied/obtained from public library?

Both?  Have them normally traded between players, but also allow players to donate their texts to a public library if they want to increase their fame at the cost of losing the other goods/texts that they could have traded the book for if they hadn't chosen to donate it.

[Chris]

This scarcity concept is one case that is handled more-or-less automatically by real-time-to-complete models ("I start studying the book at 12:57 and finish at 16:57; during those four hours, nobody else can use it"), but doesn't fit so naturally into an "action points" model - if you spend 5 seconds clicking "study book" until you run out of study points, then preventing anyone else from using the book during those 5 seconds isn't a very meaningful limitation.  How would you go about implementing a meaningful "only one person can study this book at a time" mechanic in an "action points"-based game?

Cooldown of a book (not the most natural for a point based game, but still quite OK).
OR
The book is borrowed for one day (no matter how much you use it during that time). At the end of game day it is auto returned to the library.

Imagine this conversation "Who has borrowed the book X again? Come on, I can not finish my ZZZ spell!"

[jannesiera]

Imagine this conversation "Who has borrowed the book X again? Come on, I can not finish my ZZZ spell!"

Imagine that a hundred times a day and it doesn't sound that fun anymore .

[Chris]

Players go on adventures and find random books. Books are composed of volumes, you need all values for the book to work. Up to 10 players can create a library. Each player can put a book in a library (the player does not lose the book ownership). There can be 100 books in a library. You can use all books you own and all books from the library.
- there would need to be some mechanic that prevents too often change of books in library, otherwise players would just switch them all the tiem and library would have unlimited books... How to do it?
- would it need some librarian supervision so players do not dump unneeded volumes to the library and block all the shelves? Or relay on players selfbehaviour and the option for the founder of library to kick out a wizard along with all his books?

A bit similar system for tools. You can have various mana extractors, crystal polishing machine, transdimensional analyser and other tools. These are quite easy to get and you can use then as you want all alone. You could use also tools of other wizards from the guild (no restrictions of any kind). The trick is maintenance. Each tool efficiency require "polishing" for better efficiency, and you have 100 maintenance points per day. So, it is most efficient to share tools among wizards and maintain them collectively.