RPG Wishlist

[Sinzygy]

Here's the basic mechanics of an rpg:

Each player plays one character.
This character is defined by Health(HP), some attributes for battle-calculations and energy(NRG). HP is only used for battle, NRG is used for a lot of actions (like battling or training) and the amount of energy a player can use each day is limited.
The setting for the game is a fantasy world with certain similarities to the medieval age.

Now: What would you like to be able to do in such a game?
Add anything you really would like to see, even if it's a most basic thing like "being able to heal HP at a healer's place", etc.

so, just go ahead and post

[Zeggy]

Some way to play on even when our energy is depleted. Maybe let it recharge every few minutes, or a way to buy more?
I like teamplay games, so something like clans where you can work together with clan members to achieve some goal.

[Chris]

What I dislike in RPGs is lack of players interaction (compared to strategy games). It feels like a single player game. You just kill the monsters, heal, buy equipment, repeat. I can do the same on my comp, and here I have better gfx and speed, so why should I bother to play online RPG? I do not understand the success of browser based RPGs, I must be missing something...

I would say multiplayer features are the most crucial. On the other hand many people who play these games do not care about this aspect...

[Sinzygy]

Something I'm trying to implement is some kind of multi player battles. But I'm still working on a decent concept/design to actually make it work =/

[bullarky]

I agree with Zeggy and Chris about the multiplayer aspect (especially teamplay). I think a game that successfully implements a good team-based multiplayer aspect could be very successful! I guess the question is how...

I don't know if its been done - but perhaps some kind of blend of strategy/rpg. For instance, you could take your typical strategy game of building your base and attacking other bases (with the whole clan thing of course) but add a "hero" who can do missions/do some PvE stuff (maybe PvP if done right). Then when you send troops to attack another base, you can send your hero and choose to go into RPG mode to do some extra damage/espionage/some other creative and advantageous option.

Don't know if that's even possible in BBG land?

[Sinzygy]

I don't know if its been done - but perhaps some kind of blend of strategy/rpg. For instance, you could take your typical strategy game of building your base and attacking other bases (with the whole clan thing of course) but add a "hero" who can do missions/do some PvE stuff (maybe PvP if done right). Then when you send troops to attack another base, you can send your hero and choose to go into RPG mode to do some extra damage/espionage/some other creative and advantageous option.

There are some games that try to build a hybrid of strategy-rpg elements, but I have yet to see one that actually makes sense! A lot of these are just 2 games in one which have only very little or nothing at all in common.
According to my personal taste I wouldn't play such a game. I much rather see a well done strategy game or a well done rpg than a hybrid of those games. To make one good game in one of those genres is enough work for most.

Don't know if that's even possible in BBG land?

Well, PBBGs have the disadvantage of no real-time multi player support. There are ways to do it with computer generated characters, but with real people it's a different matter. What if one participant decides to simply leave his computer and walk away during battle? And why would people want to play a text-based game in real-time? Most of them would probably play a "real" computer game instead.

Multi player support is something that usually only works in a specific way for PBBGs, not because it's not possible, but because it's the nature of these games. This said you're better of making a flash game for multiplayer than a text-based one.

[beam]

You can get close to real-time playing though. You could always implement a timeout system with AJAX, where if a player doesn't click anything for a minute or so, the other player wins by default but gains less than he normally would, and the other player loses nothing, but as a 'timeout' count increased.

The timeout count is increased every time a player abandons a battle. It stays low if the player times out for good reasons (his computer freezes, internet goes out, etc). If the timeout count gets too high because the player runs from battles he will lose, it starts to look suspicious and that player isn't allowed to battle until an admin reviews him or something.

[bullarky]

There are some games that try to build a hybrid of strategy-rpg elements, but I have yet to see one that actually makes sense!

Can you point me to some examples please?

[Dasein Fiasco]

There are some games that try to build a hybrid of strategy-rpg elements, but I have yet to see one that actually makes sense!

Can you point me to some examples please?

Final Fantasy Tactics. Disciples. Warhammer: Mark of Chaos.

Debating what does and doesn't make an RPG is the end-point of this vector of the discussion, but regardless, those are three examples I personally consider to satisfy both genres.

[Chris]

You can get close to real-time playing though. You could always implement a timeout system with AJAX

If you want realtime why not playing 3D MMORPG? Fast, excellent gfx...
One of the strong points of BBG is that you don't need to sit in front of it all the time. Some people are playing because of that.

Sure, it can be done, but why loosing competitive advantage? Let's make the game better than this 3D crap, not a cheap version of it.

[bullarky]

Thanks Dasein, but I was wondering if there were any BBG examples?

[Sinzygy]

@bullarky:
Sorry, but I forgot which games those were. They certainly were PBBGs, but I tend to register on a game, play it for a while and then forget about it. I'll let you know when I (re)find one of these games.

@beam:
Of course you can do it in such a way, but this would require both players to be online for a battle which usually means scheduling such a battle before it actually happens. Chris is quite right with his statement that the P in PBBG is the biggest advantage which a decent PBBG has to build upon. Persistence in the sense of being able to continue your work whenever you want for how long you want.

@Dasein Fiasco:
Jep, those are all great games, but I was actually referring to PBBGs.
Concerning RPGs: there are, IMHO, only very few real RPGs out on the market anymore. Mostly the RPG-genre has declined to a more sophisticated hack'n'slash type of games, with certain additions which can be trained over time.

@Chris:
I completely agree with you.

[bullarky]

@bullarky:
Sorry, but I forgot which games those were. They certainly were PBBGs, but I tend to register on a game, play it for a while and then forget about it. I'll let you know when I (re)find one of these games.

Don't go out of your way, I was just wondering if you knew of any off the top of your head.

IMHO, only very few real RPGs out on the market anymore. Mostly the RPG-genre has declined to a more sophisticated hack'n'slash type of games, with certain additions which can be trained over time.

I agree with you here. The "action RPG" is the new RPG, and although they can be fun, they don't really offer the depth of level of gameplay that a true RPG has.

[Dasein Fiasco]

Thanks Dasein, but I was wondering if there were any BBG examples?

Ah, sorry. In that case... hmm... I got nothing. Well, I'd like to say my own PBBG could claim the cross-genre title, and that's the end goal, but as it's still in development and balancing the mechanics of the war/strategy aspects alone is a massive undertaking, I'm nowhere near implementable to say nothing of sensible.

I certainly understand why it's rarely seen in the PBBG ecosystem.

[bullarky]

No problem Dasein. I look forward to seeing your game and how you've implemented the cross-genre gameplay.

[Sinzygy]

Yep, that is something I'd like to see as well.

I believe both Travian and Tribal Wars are trying to get into the cross-genre, but they aren't doing it all the way. If I heard it right the user can recruit one unit which appears to be a 'hero' or 'paladin' and serves as a special unit. But that's about it for rpg-elements.

[RangerSheck]

Strategy and RPG crossover is definitely what I'm going for in PoA (gameplay is quite like FF Tactics; however the characters are classless and advance purely on a skill based system). There are some storylines going on with the Missions (Sinzygy I know you've played a little, but I don't think you got far enough to do a Mission). Unfortunately, writing storylines with multiple paths, encounters, rewards, etc, can be quite time consuming. As others have pointed out, often a solo developer is going to be spending a lot of time fine tuning combat and character creation and advancement, and it's hard to get the best of both worlds - especially without an army of writers at your beck and call.

I opted to leave the missions with any storyline for players who have had a few battles under their belt rather than to hit them over the head with a bunch of reading when they first start the game. Personally, nothing derails me faster than too many words in a game that I'm not sure I'm even going to want to play yet. I consider the thing that sets PoA apart from other BBGs is it's party-based/tactics-RPG style of combat, so that's what I want people to experience first.

For me, the ultimate goal is: come for combat (which really is the "gameplay"), stay for your characters' development, stay for the storyline, and stay for the interaction/competition with other players,

[codestryke]

Team or group play is awesome however one of the major benefits to BBG's is you DON'T have to be online all the time. Even the box RPG's out there have problems with getting there quests played in the game because it's difficult to get 10-25 players online at one time to complete the quest and/or battle.

I've had great success with my team "portal" code.. Basically it's a mini team site that allows for the team to have there own forums, post news, see other members, recruit  other members, change theme colors etc etc. Just allowing a group of players to form an area in the game that they can meet and call there own is enough to grow a thriving community.

Know thy self... We are making BBG games not executable games. Can a multi-player battle system be made? Sure lil ajax, a lot of poll checking to see if everyone is there etc etc but why? That type of interaction and play is done and will always be done better by an executable game.